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wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il7jkvx | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,099,370 | 23 | 132 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | Thanks for asking! One thing I personally would love to see is a female protagonist or major character whose main struggle isn’t, directly or indirectly, about her being a woman. I understand and even sometimes appreciate the value of stories where women stand up to abusive men or sexist bosses but I’d really like to see more stories where the struggle would have been most the same if she was a man or in a non-misogynistic society. Misogyny is an irritating at best part of my life, I don’t want it in my “escapism” all the time Edit: one more thing is a little more balance in how many women there are. Most stories have like one women for every two to three men if not more skewed. It doesn’t have to be a perfect 1:1 but female people make up 50-52 percent of the world depending on what statistics you look at so it’s both annoying and unrealistic for it to be so heavily skewed so often | 0 | 4,940 | 5.73913 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7iav7 | il7jkvx | 1,661,098,850 | 1,661,099,370 | 18 | 132 | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | Thanks for asking! One thing I personally would love to see is a female protagonist or major character whose main struggle isn’t, directly or indirectly, about her being a woman. I understand and even sometimes appreciate the value of stories where women stand up to abusive men or sexist bosses but I’d really like to see more stories where the struggle would have been most the same if she was a man or in a non-misogynistic society. Misogyny is an irritating at best part of my life, I don’t want it in my “escapism” all the time Edit: one more thing is a little more balance in how many women there are. Most stories have like one women for every two to three men if not more skewed. It doesn’t have to be a perfect 1:1 but female people make up 50-52 percent of the world depending on what statistics you look at so it’s both annoying and unrealistic for it to be so heavily skewed so often | 0 | 520 | 7.333333 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7g4md | il86e33 | 1,661,097,962 | 1,661,108,757 | 56 | 90 | I really like when it's not all about a man. I totally like love stories too but it's nice once in a while to a (potentiell) partner doesn't play any role. Or ar least only small one. There is often a big difference as to important the general adventure is and how important the love interest. With male protagonist it often feels like a 70:30 split in favor of the adventure or whatever storyline. With female protagonist is feels like the other way around. Obviously that's still fine, just something i personally like in female protagonist or Charakters. | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 10,795 | 1.607143 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7ihrg | il86e33 | 1,661,098,926 | 1,661,108,757 | 45 | 90 | If you stop thinking about side characters as side characters, but as the heroes of their own adventures, ones you don't happen to be telling at the moment, it helps. Thus, female side characters can be like protagonists: say, like Maddie Ross in *True Grit,* Kel or Alanna in Tamora Pierce's novels, Anne in *Anne of Green Gables,* Ripley in *Alien,* Sarah Connor in *Terminator,* Emma in *Emma,* and so on. Another gimmick is to model characters on actresses. Mae West and Betty White leap to mind. When in doubt, surprise the reader. Characters that are or do what the reader expects are poison. | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 9,831 | 2 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7d8ya | il86e33 | 1,661,096,789 | 1,661,108,757 | 47 | 90 | I’m in a similar boat. All of my 3 POVs are male characters so I felt more responsibility to do right by my most prominent female character (all of them really). I was very happy with how my beta readers responded to her. Some even told me they wished she was a POV. The only thing I look for in characters, male or female is that they’re not defined by their relationship with someone else, romantic or otherwise. One of my most frustrating pains in fiction of any media is female characters that only exist as a man’s _____. One thing that worked for me. I used the same profile sheet to construct all my main characters so that means, I’m answering the same questions about all of them - background, goals, fears, strengths, weaknesses etc. Of course, not all of this makes it into the story for supporting characters but that knowledge informs how I write them. They exist solely to tip the plot forward. SN: OP, are you Irish? | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 11,968 | 1.914894 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il86e33 | il7ef2o | 1,661,108,757 | 1,661,097,270 | 90 | 31 | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | Watch promising young woman. The protagonist in that film is such a good example. I also like the trope of dying for a cause in my fiction but it seems like it's only ever males that do this. | 1 | 11,487 | 2.903226 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il86e33 | il7nhao | 1,661,108,757 | 1,661,100,945 | 90 | 30 | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | You already know what you're doing because you're already doing it with your gay leads. How do you write two gay men who are definitely gay and in a relationship without turning them into stereotypes or cliches? Well, you treat them like people who happen to be gay. How do you write good female characters? You treat them like people who happen to be female. Each one will be different. How they view makeup and how much they use it, how physically strong they are, how comfortable they are asking for help (and their reason for being or not being comfortable with this), how much they swear, their jobs, what they wear ... it's all different. I work in a warehouse and I've started wearing mostly men's clothes because it's more practical. But I'm 100% straight, married to a great guy, with two kids. My hair is super long. I wear dresses and make up if I'm going out or feel like spoiling my husband, but I rarely shave my legs. Each character you write is going to be this weird mix of trad femme, practical, masculine, quirky, damaged, strong, vulnerable, weird ... | 1 | 7,812 | 3 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il86e33 | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,108,757 | 23 | 90 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 14,327 | 3.913043 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7rtpa | il86e33 | 1,661,102,714 | 1,661,108,757 | 25 | 90 | No rape and don’t objectify the character. Have actually goals. Have her life not revolve around the love interest. | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 6,043 | 3.6 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il86e33 | il7vydl | 1,661,108,757 | 1,661,104,404 | 90 | 24 | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | A woman who’s strong, not because she’s masculine and “like a man” but rather because she is feminine! Showing that femininity and sensitivity in itself is a strength of it’s own! Just because she’s kind and sweet doesn’t automatically mean she’s a shy pushover. On the contrary she will stand up for herself and others when wronged. She can be sharp and and tough when needed, without that taking away from her innocent, sweet nature. | 1 | 4,353 | 3.75 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7oooa | il86e33 | 1,661,101,435 | 1,661,108,757 | 20 | 90 | Don’t make them ‘not like other girls.’ Theres nothing interesting about reading about a girl who just bashes other women for wearing make up or sleeping with a lot of people, like they feel superior to them just because they like ‘masculine hobbies’ shut up. | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 7,322 | 4.5 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7iav7 | il86e33 | 1,661,098,850 | 1,661,108,757 | 18 | 90 | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | Being both classically feminine and an absolute badass. Too often female characters are one or the other, but not both. Characters that dress appropriately for the activity/weather. Characters that aren't just a Greek chorus for the MC | 0 | 9,907 | 5 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7g4md | il7d8ya | 1,661,097,962 | 1,661,096,789 | 56 | 47 | I really like when it's not all about a man. I totally like love stories too but it's nice once in a while to a (potentiell) partner doesn't play any role. Or ar least only small one. There is often a big difference as to important the general adventure is and how important the love interest. With male protagonist it often feels like a 70:30 split in favor of the adventure or whatever storyline. With female protagonist is feels like the other way around. Obviously that's still fine, just something i personally like in female protagonist or Charakters. | I’m in a similar boat. All of my 3 POVs are male characters so I felt more responsibility to do right by my most prominent female character (all of them really). I was very happy with how my beta readers responded to her. Some even told me they wished she was a POV. The only thing I look for in characters, male or female is that they’re not defined by their relationship with someone else, romantic or otherwise. One of my most frustrating pains in fiction of any media is female characters that only exist as a man’s _____. One thing that worked for me. I used the same profile sheet to construct all my main characters so that means, I’m answering the same questions about all of them - background, goals, fears, strengths, weaknesses etc. Of course, not all of this makes it into the story for supporting characters but that knowledge informs how I write them. They exist solely to tip the plot forward. SN: OP, are you Irish? | 1 | 1,173 | 1.191489 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7g4md | il7ef2o | 1,661,097,962 | 1,661,097,270 | 56 | 31 | I really like when it's not all about a man. I totally like love stories too but it's nice once in a while to a (potentiell) partner doesn't play any role. Or ar least only small one. There is often a big difference as to important the general adventure is and how important the love interest. With male protagonist it often feels like a 70:30 split in favor of the adventure or whatever storyline. With female protagonist is feels like the other way around. Obviously that's still fine, just something i personally like in female protagonist or Charakters. | Watch promising young woman. The protagonist in that film is such a good example. I also like the trope of dying for a cause in my fiction but it seems like it's only ever males that do this. | 1 | 692 | 1.806452 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il7g4md | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,097,962 | 23 | 56 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | I really like when it's not all about a man. I totally like love stories too but it's nice once in a while to a (potentiell) partner doesn't play any role. Or ar least only small one. There is often a big difference as to important the general adventure is and how important the love interest. With male protagonist it often feels like a 70:30 split in favor of the adventure or whatever storyline. With female protagonist is feels like the other way around. Obviously that's still fine, just something i personally like in female protagonist or Charakters. | 0 | 3,532 | 2.434783 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7ihrg | il7ef2o | 1,661,098,926 | 1,661,097,270 | 45 | 31 | If you stop thinking about side characters as side characters, but as the heroes of their own adventures, ones you don't happen to be telling at the moment, it helps. Thus, female side characters can be like protagonists: say, like Maddie Ross in *True Grit,* Kel or Alanna in Tamora Pierce's novels, Anne in *Anne of Green Gables,* Ripley in *Alien,* Sarah Connor in *Terminator,* Emma in *Emma,* and so on. Another gimmick is to model characters on actresses. Mae West and Betty White leap to mind. When in doubt, surprise the reader. Characters that are or do what the reader expects are poison. | Watch promising young woman. The protagonist in that film is such a good example. I also like the trope of dying for a cause in my fiction but it seems like it's only ever males that do this. | 1 | 1,656 | 1.451613 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il7ihrg | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,098,926 | 23 | 45 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | If you stop thinking about side characters as side characters, but as the heroes of their own adventures, ones you don't happen to be telling at the moment, it helps. Thus, female side characters can be like protagonists: say, like Maddie Ross in *True Grit,* Kel or Alanna in Tamora Pierce's novels, Anne in *Anne of Green Gables,* Ripley in *Alien,* Sarah Connor in *Terminator,* Emma in *Emma,* and so on. Another gimmick is to model characters on actresses. Mae West and Betty White leap to mind. When in doubt, surprise the reader. Characters that are or do what the reader expects are poison. | 0 | 4,496 | 1.956522 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7ihrg | il7iav7 | 1,661,098,926 | 1,661,098,850 | 45 | 18 | If you stop thinking about side characters as side characters, but as the heroes of their own adventures, ones you don't happen to be telling at the moment, it helps. Thus, female side characters can be like protagonists: say, like Maddie Ross in *True Grit,* Kel or Alanna in Tamora Pierce's novels, Anne in *Anne of Green Gables,* Ripley in *Alien,* Sarah Connor in *Terminator,* Emma in *Emma,* and so on. Another gimmick is to model characters on actresses. Mae West and Betty White leap to mind. When in doubt, surprise the reader. Characters that are or do what the reader expects are poison. | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | 1 | 76 | 2.5 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7d8ya | il77p0u | 1,661,096,789 | 1,661,094,430 | 47 | 23 | I’m in a similar boat. All of my 3 POVs are male characters so I felt more responsibility to do right by my most prominent female character (all of them really). I was very happy with how my beta readers responded to her. Some even told me they wished she was a POV. The only thing I look for in characters, male or female is that they’re not defined by their relationship with someone else, romantic or otherwise. One of my most frustrating pains in fiction of any media is female characters that only exist as a man’s _____. One thing that worked for me. I used the same profile sheet to construct all my main characters so that means, I’m answering the same questions about all of them - background, goals, fears, strengths, weaknesses etc. Of course, not all of this makes it into the story for supporting characters but that knowledge informs how I write them. They exist solely to tip the plot forward. SN: OP, are you Irish? | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | 1 | 2,359 | 2.043478 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il7ef2o | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,097,270 | 23 | 31 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | Watch promising young woman. The protagonist in that film is such a good example. I also like the trope of dying for a cause in my fiction but it seems like it's only ever males that do this. | 0 | 2,840 | 1.347826 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il7nhao | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,100,945 | 23 | 30 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | You already know what you're doing because you're already doing it with your gay leads. How do you write two gay men who are definitely gay and in a relationship without turning them into stereotypes or cliches? Well, you treat them like people who happen to be gay. How do you write good female characters? You treat them like people who happen to be female. Each one will be different. How they view makeup and how much they use it, how physically strong they are, how comfortable they are asking for help (and their reason for being or not being comfortable with this), how much they swear, their jobs, what they wear ... it's all different. I work in a warehouse and I've started wearing mostly men's clothes because it's more practical. But I'm 100% straight, married to a great guy, with two kids. My hair is super long. I wear dresses and make up if I'm going out or feel like spoiling my husband, but I rarely shave my legs. Each character you write is going to be this weird mix of trad femme, practical, masculine, quirky, damaged, strong, vulnerable, weird ... | 0 | 6,515 | 1.304348 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7nhao | il7iav7 | 1,661,100,945 | 1,661,098,850 | 30 | 18 | You already know what you're doing because you're already doing it with your gay leads. How do you write two gay men who are definitely gay and in a relationship without turning them into stereotypes or cliches? Well, you treat them like people who happen to be gay. How do you write good female characters? You treat them like people who happen to be female. Each one will be different. How they view makeup and how much they use it, how physically strong they are, how comfortable they are asking for help (and their reason for being or not being comfortable with this), how much they swear, their jobs, what they wear ... it's all different. I work in a warehouse and I've started wearing mostly men's clothes because it's more practical. But I'm 100% straight, married to a great guy, with two kids. My hair is super long. I wear dresses and make up if I'm going out or feel like spoiling my husband, but I rarely shave my legs. Each character you write is going to be this weird mix of trad femme, practical, masculine, quirky, damaged, strong, vulnerable, weird ... | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | 1 | 2,095 | 1.666667 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il77p0u | il7rtpa | 1,661,094,430 | 1,661,102,714 | 23 | 25 | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | No rape and don’t objectify the character. Have actually goals. Have her life not revolve around the love interest. | 0 | 8,284 | 1.086957 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7vydl | il77p0u | 1,661,104,404 | 1,661,094,430 | 24 | 23 | A woman who’s strong, not because she’s masculine and “like a man” but rather because she is feminine! Showing that femininity and sensitivity in itself is a strength of it’s own! Just because she’s kind and sweet doesn’t automatically mean she’s a shy pushover. On the contrary she will stand up for herself and others when wronged. She can be sharp and and tough when needed, without that taking away from her innocent, sweet nature. | My friend, one thing.. only one thing. Make a woman strong when the time comes. A strong woman doesn't go around acting all rough and tough slapping males. They needn't be loud, as another redditor mentioned. And i hate that extremely high pitched girl scream.. don't do that. Make the girl fearless, and make her a worthy protagonist or partner of the protagonist, who really helps, instead of being Mary Jane and screaming all the time without helping. I like it when they know martial arts, like Black Widow. Don't make her a Mary Sue though. No "Mary"s 😅😂 I like the silent female characters, who act like they don't like a male character first, then suddenly, you can use it as a plot twist, she reveals that she likes him. | 1 | 9,974 | 1.043478 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7oooa | il7rtpa | 1,661,101,435 | 1,661,102,714 | 20 | 25 | Don’t make them ‘not like other girls.’ Theres nothing interesting about reading about a girl who just bashes other women for wearing make up or sleeping with a lot of people, like they feel superior to them just because they like ‘masculine hobbies’ shut up. | No rape and don’t objectify the character. Have actually goals. Have her life not revolve around the love interest. | 0 | 1,279 | 1.25 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7iav7 | il7rtpa | 1,661,098,850 | 1,661,102,714 | 18 | 25 | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | No rape and don’t objectify the character. Have actually goals. Have her life not revolve around the love interest. | 0 | 3,864 | 1.388889 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7oooa | il7vydl | 1,661,101,435 | 1,661,104,404 | 20 | 24 | Don’t make them ‘not like other girls.’ Theres nothing interesting about reading about a girl who just bashes other women for wearing make up or sleeping with a lot of people, like they feel superior to them just because they like ‘masculine hobbies’ shut up. | A woman who’s strong, not because she’s masculine and “like a man” but rather because she is feminine! Showing that femininity and sensitivity in itself is a strength of it’s own! Just because she’s kind and sweet doesn’t automatically mean she’s a shy pushover. On the contrary she will stand up for herself and others when wronged. She can be sharp and and tough when needed, without that taking away from her innocent, sweet nature. | 0 | 2,969 | 1.2 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7iav7 | il7vydl | 1,661,098,850 | 1,661,104,404 | 18 | 24 | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | A woman who’s strong, not because she’s masculine and “like a man” but rather because she is feminine! Showing that femininity and sensitivity in itself is a strength of it’s own! Just because she’s kind and sweet doesn’t automatically mean she’s a shy pushover. On the contrary she will stand up for herself and others when wronged. She can be sharp and and tough when needed, without that taking away from her innocent, sweet nature. | 0 | 5,554 | 1.333333 | ||
wtzzia | writing_train | 0.9 | What is something you want to see from female characters in stories that you normally don’t see? I’m a writer and I have two male main characters who are gay (for each other). I wanted that representation as a bi guy, but have to sacrifice writing a strong female lead. I want my side characters to feel like more than side characters and would love your input! I’d hate for my side characters to be another case of female side characters. | il7oooa | il7iav7 | 1,661,101,435 | 1,661,098,850 | 20 | 18 | Don’t make them ‘not like other girls.’ Theres nothing interesting about reading about a girl who just bashes other women for wearing make up or sleeping with a lot of people, like they feel superior to them just because they like ‘masculine hobbies’ shut up. | A buff strong woman. Not those skinny women in bikinis that go and fight. Or just a female character that is genuinely funny, and can be strong at the same time. Not the “oh she’s broken but she’s strong” trope. I can’t even find any funny female characters. They’re always just sassy or strong. The men get to be strong and funny, the women seem to only be strong. Edit: and heavier female characters. I rarely ever see any big female characters. Sometimes there are heavier men in the books I read, but all the women are really skinny and fit beauty standards. | 1 | 2,585 | 1.111111 | ||
mo7szp | writing_train | 0.84 | What are the rules for referencing characters from other works of fiction in your novel? How far can you go in mentioning characters from other works of fiction, songs, etc in your novel? I’m sure you can’t have the actually character present but can you even reference the existence of them by name? | gu26lj1 | gu23ncp | 1,618,074,434 | 1,618,072,977 | 25 | 2 | You can mention fictional works as fictional works (your character is a huge Star Wars fan or someone says "Hey, get out of the library for once, Hermione!" to their friend Susan who reads a lot). You can not use them as real things in your fictional world (e.g. your character can't go live on the Millennium Falcon or talk about how Hermione is a new student at the school--even if she's never "on screen") Songs, you can use the titles. Lyrics are a copyright nightmare and should be avoided. | You can reference them no problem. | 1 | 1,457 | 12.5 | ||
mo7szp | writing_train | 0.84 | What are the rules for referencing characters from other works of fiction in your novel? How far can you go in mentioning characters from other works of fiction, songs, etc in your novel? I’m sure you can’t have the actually character present but can you even reference the existence of them by name? | gu26lj1 | gu24a4p | 1,618,074,434 | 1,618,073,294 | 25 | 1 | You can mention fictional works as fictional works (your character is a huge Star Wars fan or someone says "Hey, get out of the library for once, Hermione!" to their friend Susan who reads a lot). You can not use them as real things in your fictional world (e.g. your character can't go live on the Millennium Falcon or talk about how Hermione is a new student at the school--even if she's never "on screen") Songs, you can use the titles. Lyrics are a copyright nightmare and should be avoided. | It depends - do you want to reference them as a character from a book or as an existing person? If it's the latter, you might run into copyright issues because you're merging your own universe with some other writer's. | 1 | 1,140 | 25 | ||
mo7szp | writing_train | 0.84 | What are the rules for referencing characters from other works of fiction in your novel? How far can you go in mentioning characters from other works of fiction, songs, etc in your novel? I’m sure you can’t have the actually character present but can you even reference the existence of them by name? | gu2vejm | gu23ncp | 1,618,087,175 | 1,618,072,977 | 7 | 2 | If you want to pay omage remeber that the scene must work even if reader doesn't know what you are referencing to. Shrek 2 had a scene where fiomas ring dropped from the air to her finger. This was omage to lord of the rings. The scene was adorable. I didn't need to have to watch the lord of the rings to enjoy the scene. Knowing the referencecwas just extra/plus Game of thrones had three stooges in a bar. It didn't affect my reading that I didn't get the reference. If I didn't know who was harry potter then your characters calking eachother such is damaging to my enjoyment since you as a author are counting on I know who potter is. Edit: you are safe using famous characters like potter, but be careful. | You can reference them no problem. | 1 | 14,198 | 3.5 | ||
mo7szp | writing_train | 0.84 | What are the rules for referencing characters from other works of fiction in your novel? How far can you go in mentioning characters from other works of fiction, songs, etc in your novel? I’m sure you can’t have the actually character present but can you even reference the existence of them by name? | gu24a4p | gu2vejm | 1,618,073,294 | 1,618,087,175 | 1 | 7 | It depends - do you want to reference them as a character from a book or as an existing person? If it's the latter, you might run into copyright issues because you're merging your own universe with some other writer's. | If you want to pay omage remeber that the scene must work even if reader doesn't know what you are referencing to. Shrek 2 had a scene where fiomas ring dropped from the air to her finger. This was omage to lord of the rings. The scene was adorable. I didn't need to have to watch the lord of the rings to enjoy the scene. Knowing the referencecwas just extra/plus Game of thrones had three stooges in a bar. It didn't affect my reading that I didn't get the reference. If I didn't know who was harry potter then your characters calking eachother such is damaging to my enjoyment since you as a author are counting on I know who potter is. Edit: you are safe using famous characters like potter, but be careful. | 0 | 13,881 | 7 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvbsm1e | cvbua23 | 1,443,041,112 | 1,443,043,514 | 1 | 4 | You said you crunched through your first draft. For me, it was kind of in the same ball park. It also sounds to me like you're heavily invested in the outlining aspect of your story. That can be a good and bad thing. It's great for organizing your thoughts and manipulating your story structure, but if you're "stalled out", excessive outlining won't get your engine started again. My advice depends on whether or not you plan on tossing out a large chunk of your story or the whole enchilada. If it's the former, I would suggest nailing down your outline and getting after this next draft with the same mentality you had in your first draft. Push to the end and reevaluate afterward. And don't look at it like it's your final draft. Unless you already have a book deal in place, this is still the experimental phase of the process. If it's the latter, the only difference in my advice would be the outlining. Restructuring a story and rebuilding it are two VERY different processes. If you are rebuilding it from the ground up, you're going to need to revert back to the first draft method, which involves a much broader outline that won't handcuff your storytelling. I realize I didn't share any of my own struggles, but since you flared this as advice, I figured this would be more helpful. | I'm not a person who outlines much before I write the first draft, but before I go in for a big structural rewrite, I always outline the current draft, and work from that outline to prepare a new outline -- figuring out which new scenes will go in, which scenes will come out, which scenes will have to be rearranged, what kind of major changes I'll need in each scene. I like to get a pack of index cards and write a sentence per scene on each - just a summary of the main action of the scene - and use the rest of the index card to jot down any major changes I need in that scene; then I can rearrange them as I like. Sometimes it's helpful for me, when writing a draft with major changes, to open up a separate word processor document, and open it up side by side with the old one; I find that when you're making big changes, it shifts the tone and the voice of the book, and typing out a new document is how I make sure I don't stick to the words from the old draft just because they're there. (I admit I don't retype the whole thing -- there's always some copy-and-pasting going on -- but it keeps me more aware, I think.) | 0 | 2,402 | 4 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvcg0g4 | cvbvuzg | 1,443,095,234 | 1,443,045,949 | 4 | 3 | Put it in a drawer and work on something else. Sometimes these things need to age, like fine wine, cheese, or that hot person at the bar who likely got in with a fake ID. | I made a scene list in a spreadsheet. I found all the problem areas, made the necessary changes, and edited the scene list until it was what I wanted. Then I went back to the draft. | 1 | 49,285 | 1.333333 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvbzs14 | cvcg0g4 | 1,443,052,738 | 1,443,095,234 | 2 | 4 | I got to the end of my first draft of my novel and realised the twist I thought would work, didn't. It was contrived and everyone would know it. After much swearing, gnashing of teeth and the brief consideration of suicide, I worked out that a character I killed off near the beginning would be the solution. I went back and saved his life and wove his story through the novel so that he could be where he needed to be at the end and it all would seem perfectly logical and believable. But the fact he survived impacted the rest of the story and characters, so after inserting his chapters I had to go line by line through the rest and ask myself: is this scene/character/situation affected by the 'new' character? The answer was 'yes' more often than I liked, but I made all the changes and made it work. It turned out fine and eventually I found a publisher. And the character now looks like he was always there the whole time! | Put it in a drawer and work on something else. Sometimes these things need to age, like fine wine, cheese, or that hot person at the bar who likely got in with a fake ID. | 0 | 42,496 | 2 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvc6onf | cvcg0g4 | 1,443,064,715 | 1,443,095,234 | 2 | 4 | Stalling is inevitable - and it sounds like you did the right thing, bringing in people that you trust and respect to take a look. So here's what I do: I first compile a list of all the feedback and changes I plan to make into single document written in my own words. And then I pick the absolute smallest, easiest change to make and I do that. If you try to take on everything at once, it's easy for the perfectionist self-doubter to sail right past actually getting anything done and directly into self-immolation. So start as small as possible. By the time you finally get to the big stuff, it will feel much more achievable. | Put it in a drawer and work on something else. Sometimes these things need to age, like fine wine, cheese, or that hot person at the bar who likely got in with a fake ID. | 0 | 30,519 | 2 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvccs7a | cvcg0g4 | 1,443,081,416 | 1,443,095,234 | 2 | 4 | Slash and burn. Delete everything and start over. I've found this to be far more efficient than big revision...even when it means throwing 100k words in the garbage. | Put it in a drawer and work on something else. Sometimes these things need to age, like fine wine, cheese, or that hot person at the bar who likely got in with a fake ID. | 0 | 13,818 | 2 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvbsm1e | cvcg0g4 | 1,443,041,112 | 1,443,095,234 | 1 | 4 | You said you crunched through your first draft. For me, it was kind of in the same ball park. It also sounds to me like you're heavily invested in the outlining aspect of your story. That can be a good and bad thing. It's great for organizing your thoughts and manipulating your story structure, but if you're "stalled out", excessive outlining won't get your engine started again. My advice depends on whether or not you plan on tossing out a large chunk of your story or the whole enchilada. If it's the former, I would suggest nailing down your outline and getting after this next draft with the same mentality you had in your first draft. Push to the end and reevaluate afterward. And don't look at it like it's your final draft. Unless you already have a book deal in place, this is still the experimental phase of the process. If it's the latter, the only difference in my advice would be the outlining. Restructuring a story and rebuilding it are two VERY different processes. If you are rebuilding it from the ground up, you're going to need to revert back to the first draft method, which involves a much broader outline that won't handcuff your storytelling. I realize I didn't share any of my own struggles, but since you flared this as advice, I figured this would be more helpful. | Put it in a drawer and work on something else. Sometimes these things need to age, like fine wine, cheese, or that hot person at the bar who likely got in with a fake ID. | 0 | 54,122 | 4 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvcg0g4 | cvca2pv | 1,443,095,234 | 1,443,072,253 | 4 | 1 | Put it in a drawer and work on something else. Sometimes these things need to age, like fine wine, cheese, or that hot person at the bar who likely got in with a fake ID. | Relax, already. You're only on the fourth draft and the rule-of-thumb is "eight drafts to publication." After you rewrite it a couple more times, and know the story inside and out, maybe then it's time to pay for a pro, but not until this story is to you what the Matrix was to Neo (is what I'd say). | 1 | 22,981 | 4 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvbvuzg | cvbsm1e | 1,443,045,949 | 1,443,041,112 | 3 | 1 | I made a scene list in a spreadsheet. I found all the problem areas, made the necessary changes, and edited the scene list until it was what I wanted. Then I went back to the draft. | You said you crunched through your first draft. For me, it was kind of in the same ball park. It also sounds to me like you're heavily invested in the outlining aspect of your story. That can be a good and bad thing. It's great for organizing your thoughts and manipulating your story structure, but if you're "stalled out", excessive outlining won't get your engine started again. My advice depends on whether or not you plan on tossing out a large chunk of your story or the whole enchilada. If it's the former, I would suggest nailing down your outline and getting after this next draft with the same mentality you had in your first draft. Push to the end and reevaluate afterward. And don't look at it like it's your final draft. Unless you already have a book deal in place, this is still the experimental phase of the process. If it's the latter, the only difference in my advice would be the outlining. Restructuring a story and rebuilding it are two VERY different processes. If you are rebuilding it from the ground up, you're going to need to revert back to the first draft method, which involves a much broader outline that won't handcuff your storytelling. I realize I didn't share any of my own struggles, but since you flared this as advice, I figured this would be more helpful. | 1 | 4,837 | 3 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvbzs14 | cvbsm1e | 1,443,052,738 | 1,443,041,112 | 2 | 1 | I got to the end of my first draft of my novel and realised the twist I thought would work, didn't. It was contrived and everyone would know it. After much swearing, gnashing of teeth and the brief consideration of suicide, I worked out that a character I killed off near the beginning would be the solution. I went back and saved his life and wove his story through the novel so that he could be where he needed to be at the end and it all would seem perfectly logical and believable. But the fact he survived impacted the rest of the story and characters, so after inserting his chapters I had to go line by line through the rest and ask myself: is this scene/character/situation affected by the 'new' character? The answer was 'yes' more often than I liked, but I made all the changes and made it work. It turned out fine and eventually I found a publisher. And the character now looks like he was always there the whole time! | You said you crunched through your first draft. For me, it was kind of in the same ball park. It also sounds to me like you're heavily invested in the outlining aspect of your story. That can be a good and bad thing. It's great for organizing your thoughts and manipulating your story structure, but if you're "stalled out", excessive outlining won't get your engine started again. My advice depends on whether or not you plan on tossing out a large chunk of your story or the whole enchilada. If it's the former, I would suggest nailing down your outline and getting after this next draft with the same mentality you had in your first draft. Push to the end and reevaluate afterward. And don't look at it like it's your final draft. Unless you already have a book deal in place, this is still the experimental phase of the process. If it's the latter, the only difference in my advice would be the outlining. Restructuring a story and rebuilding it are two VERY different processes. If you are rebuilding it from the ground up, you're going to need to revert back to the first draft method, which involves a much broader outline that won't handcuff your storytelling. I realize I didn't share any of my own struggles, but since you flared this as advice, I figured this would be more helpful. | 1 | 11,626 | 2 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvc6onf | cvbsm1e | 1,443,064,715 | 1,443,041,112 | 2 | 1 | Stalling is inevitable - and it sounds like you did the right thing, bringing in people that you trust and respect to take a look. So here's what I do: I first compile a list of all the feedback and changes I plan to make into single document written in my own words. And then I pick the absolute smallest, easiest change to make and I do that. If you try to take on everything at once, it's easy for the perfectionist self-doubter to sail right past actually getting anything done and directly into self-immolation. So start as small as possible. By the time you finally get to the big stuff, it will feel much more achievable. | You said you crunched through your first draft. For me, it was kind of in the same ball park. It also sounds to me like you're heavily invested in the outlining aspect of your story. That can be a good and bad thing. It's great for organizing your thoughts and manipulating your story structure, but if you're "stalled out", excessive outlining won't get your engine started again. My advice depends on whether or not you plan on tossing out a large chunk of your story or the whole enchilada. If it's the former, I would suggest nailing down your outline and getting after this next draft with the same mentality you had in your first draft. Push to the end and reevaluate afterward. And don't look at it like it's your final draft. Unless you already have a book deal in place, this is still the experimental phase of the process. If it's the latter, the only difference in my advice would be the outlining. Restructuring a story and rebuilding it are two VERY different processes. If you are rebuilding it from the ground up, you're going to need to revert back to the first draft method, which involves a much broader outline that won't handcuff your storytelling. I realize I didn't share any of my own struggles, but since you flared this as advice, I figured this would be more helpful. | 1 | 23,603 | 2 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvccs7a | cvbsm1e | 1,443,081,416 | 1,443,041,112 | 2 | 1 | Slash and burn. Delete everything and start over. I've found this to be far more efficient than big revision...even when it means throwing 100k words in the garbage. | You said you crunched through your first draft. For me, it was kind of in the same ball park. It also sounds to me like you're heavily invested in the outlining aspect of your story. That can be a good and bad thing. It's great for organizing your thoughts and manipulating your story structure, but if you're "stalled out", excessive outlining won't get your engine started again. My advice depends on whether or not you plan on tossing out a large chunk of your story or the whole enchilada. If it's the former, I would suggest nailing down your outline and getting after this next draft with the same mentality you had in your first draft. Push to the end and reevaluate afterward. And don't look at it like it's your final draft. Unless you already have a book deal in place, this is still the experimental phase of the process. If it's the latter, the only difference in my advice would be the outlining. Restructuring a story and rebuilding it are two VERY different processes. If you are rebuilding it from the ground up, you're going to need to revert back to the first draft method, which involves a much broader outline that won't handcuff your storytelling. I realize I didn't share any of my own struggles, but since you flared this as advice, I figured this would be more helpful. | 1 | 40,304 | 2 | ||
3m3vn1 | writing_train | 0.93 | Those of you who "stalled out" in the later drafts of your novel due to major plot/structure changes, what was your method of finishing? By "stalling out" I mean like an engine mid-flight. You've written at least 2 drafts of your novel something happened or clicked and you decided to rework the bones of your story, when at that point, most writers are just tweaking the muscles. By "something happened" I mean you decided a major plot change was in order, or perhaps you received feedback that inspired major additions or subtractions to the story. For me, it was a combination. I crunched through my first draft. Wrote a second draft that was a huge improvement. Wrote a third draft and decided to share it with two people I really trust and respect. Received feedback that was extremely helpful, while spending some time apart from the story and reorganizing my thoughts and spotting some glaring issues. Now I'm in the process of reworking my outline and prepping for what I hope will be my final draft before I hire an editor. For those of you who can relate to my situation, what was your plan of attack for conquering the hurdle of self-doubt and a perfectionist mentality? What clicked for you and allowed you to finish what you started? How did it turn out? | cvccs7a | cvca2pv | 1,443,081,416 | 1,443,072,253 | 2 | 1 | Slash and burn. Delete everything and start over. I've found this to be far more efficient than big revision...even when it means throwing 100k words in the garbage. | Relax, already. You're only on the fourth draft and the rule-of-thumb is "eight drafts to publication." After you rewrite it a couple more times, and know the story inside and out, maybe then it's time to pay for a pro, but not until this story is to you what the Matrix was to Neo (is what I'd say). | 1 | 9,163 | 2 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgbs2w | htgbq7e | 1,642,683,825 | 1,642,683,797 | 18 | 12 | Maybe because there is less pressure at work to write well since it is not your job or At work you would rather write and at home you would rather do other things. When I write it often comes out as crap at first but if you keep going you can get into a zone. Don’t let motivation be your guide, just write whether you feel like it or not. | In my opinion, working (be it physical or mental) “frees” the mind and allows creativity to flow. Whenever I have too much time due to semester break or whatever, my ability to write a lot subsides and I start to struggle. But when I give myself tasks that I don’t necessarily enjoy but that become part of my routine (waking up at 5:30-6 to go on a run/help out at the family business/fill my social calendar) creativity returns. I think it’s because of mental stimuli. You don’t really get that much when being in the comfort of your own home and sitting on the couch. | 1 | 28 | 1.5 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htg5ncu | htgbs2w | 1,642,680,156 | 1,642,683,825 | 5 | 18 | Many people have that problem! There's two ways to solve it: location or distraction. Go to a coffee shop or other place where you don't usually hang out. Not exactly workable during covid, but you could try a less-used room in your place too, or in summer a corner of the garden. Some people sit in the kitchen or in the hallway to write. Behind the couch. This method can be enhanced by writing on a different medium - paper instead of computer, phone instead of tablet etc. Alternately, acquire a hobby that can be done in short bits and doesn't require much brain space. A free online game for example. Then switch between playing a bit, writing a bit, playing a bit. This method works for me - every time I get stuck, I just play a bit instead of getting more and more stuck. Then two or three minutes later, I go back to writing. | Maybe because there is less pressure at work to write well since it is not your job or At work you would rather write and at home you would rather do other things. When I write it often comes out as crap at first but if you keep going you can get into a zone. Don’t let motivation be your guide, just write whether you feel like it or not. | 0 | 3,669 | 3.6 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htga47x | htgbs2w | 1,642,682,901 | 1,642,683,825 | 4 | 18 | Do you actually feel sick ? Cuz I got sick not long ago so I was at home and got frustrated not having the energy to write while having so much free time at home. But that's how it is, don't feel bad about it if you are actually sick | Maybe because there is less pressure at work to write well since it is not your job or At work you would rather write and at home you would rather do other things. When I write it often comes out as crap at first but if you keep going you can get into a zone. Don’t let motivation be your guide, just write whether you feel like it or not. | 0 | 924 | 4.5 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgbs2w | htg9lgc | 1,642,683,825 | 1,642,682,604 | 18 | 3 | Maybe because there is less pressure at work to write well since it is not your job or At work you would rather write and at home you would rather do other things. When I write it often comes out as crap at first but if you keep going you can get into a zone. Don’t let motivation be your guide, just write whether you feel like it or not. | Oh this is easy! It's because you're a writer, sweety. Nobody gets the blessing without an irretrievably stupid curse that makes it infuriating to use. If your particular madness is only working between other tasks, make those other tasks a second and third story. Then you're ALWAYS procrastinating on your story...by writing other stories. You've gotta roll with the madness or the madness is going to roll you. | 1 | 1,221 | 6 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htg5ncu | htgbq7e | 1,642,680,156 | 1,642,683,797 | 5 | 12 | Many people have that problem! There's two ways to solve it: location or distraction. Go to a coffee shop or other place where you don't usually hang out. Not exactly workable during covid, but you could try a less-used room in your place too, or in summer a corner of the garden. Some people sit in the kitchen or in the hallway to write. Behind the couch. This method can be enhanced by writing on a different medium - paper instead of computer, phone instead of tablet etc. Alternately, acquire a hobby that can be done in short bits and doesn't require much brain space. A free online game for example. Then switch between playing a bit, writing a bit, playing a bit. This method works for me - every time I get stuck, I just play a bit instead of getting more and more stuck. Then two or three minutes later, I go back to writing. | In my opinion, working (be it physical or mental) “frees” the mind and allows creativity to flow. Whenever I have too much time due to semester break or whatever, my ability to write a lot subsides and I start to struggle. But when I give myself tasks that I don’t necessarily enjoy but that become part of my routine (waking up at 5:30-6 to go on a run/help out at the family business/fill my social calendar) creativity returns. I think it’s because of mental stimuli. You don’t really get that much when being in the comfort of your own home and sitting on the couch. | 0 | 3,641 | 2.4 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgbq7e | htga47x | 1,642,683,797 | 1,642,682,901 | 12 | 4 | In my opinion, working (be it physical or mental) “frees” the mind and allows creativity to flow. Whenever I have too much time due to semester break or whatever, my ability to write a lot subsides and I start to struggle. But when I give myself tasks that I don’t necessarily enjoy but that become part of my routine (waking up at 5:30-6 to go on a run/help out at the family business/fill my social calendar) creativity returns. I think it’s because of mental stimuli. You don’t really get that much when being in the comfort of your own home and sitting on the couch. | Do you actually feel sick ? Cuz I got sick not long ago so I was at home and got frustrated not having the energy to write while having so much free time at home. But that's how it is, don't feel bad about it if you are actually sick | 1 | 896 | 3 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htg9lgc | htgbq7e | 1,642,682,604 | 1,642,683,797 | 3 | 12 | Oh this is easy! It's because you're a writer, sweety. Nobody gets the blessing without an irretrievably stupid curse that makes it infuriating to use. If your particular madness is only working between other tasks, make those other tasks a second and third story. Then you're ALWAYS procrastinating on your story...by writing other stories. You've gotta roll with the madness or the madness is going to roll you. | In my opinion, working (be it physical or mental) “frees” the mind and allows creativity to flow. Whenever I have too much time due to semester break or whatever, my ability to write a lot subsides and I start to struggle. But when I give myself tasks that I don’t necessarily enjoy but that become part of my routine (waking up at 5:30-6 to go on a run/help out at the family business/fill my social calendar) creativity returns. I think it’s because of mental stimuli. You don’t really get that much when being in the comfort of your own home and sitting on the couch. | 0 | 1,193 | 4 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htg5ncu | htgkbkc | 1,642,680,156 | 1,642,688,017 | 5 | 7 | Many people have that problem! There's two ways to solve it: location or distraction. Go to a coffee shop or other place where you don't usually hang out. Not exactly workable during covid, but you could try a less-used room in your place too, or in summer a corner of the garden. Some people sit in the kitchen or in the hallway to write. Behind the couch. This method can be enhanced by writing on a different medium - paper instead of computer, phone instead of tablet etc. Alternately, acquire a hobby that can be done in short bits and doesn't require much brain space. A free online game for example. Then switch between playing a bit, writing a bit, playing a bit. This method works for me - every time I get stuck, I just play a bit instead of getting more and more stuck. Then two or three minutes later, I go back to writing. | Eric Hoffer (Philosopher) famously known as the longshoreman philosopher would work menial jobs as a migrant, day laborer, longshoreman because it gave him time to think. Your situation is no different really. You disconnect your mind from what you're doing (hopefully you're not a surgeon or nuclear weapons designer) which allows you to really focus on your thoughts. I write better in the AM and when I'm at work, like you. We just need something to distract us and let the creative mind spill out. How do you fake that? Exercise or other menial tasks should help you unlock and let that creativity flow. At least, that's the theory. | 0 | 7,861 | 1.4 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgkbkc | htga47x | 1,642,688,017 | 1,642,682,901 | 7 | 4 | Eric Hoffer (Philosopher) famously known as the longshoreman philosopher would work menial jobs as a migrant, day laborer, longshoreman because it gave him time to think. Your situation is no different really. You disconnect your mind from what you're doing (hopefully you're not a surgeon or nuclear weapons designer) which allows you to really focus on your thoughts. I write better in the AM and when I'm at work, like you. We just need something to distract us and let the creative mind spill out. How do you fake that? Exercise or other menial tasks should help you unlock and let that creativity flow. At least, that's the theory. | Do you actually feel sick ? Cuz I got sick not long ago so I was at home and got frustrated not having the energy to write while having so much free time at home. But that's how it is, don't feel bad about it if you are actually sick | 1 | 5,116 | 1.75 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgkbkc | htg9lgc | 1,642,688,017 | 1,642,682,604 | 7 | 3 | Eric Hoffer (Philosopher) famously known as the longshoreman philosopher would work menial jobs as a migrant, day laborer, longshoreman because it gave him time to think. Your situation is no different really. You disconnect your mind from what you're doing (hopefully you're not a surgeon or nuclear weapons designer) which allows you to really focus on your thoughts. I write better in the AM and when I'm at work, like you. We just need something to distract us and let the creative mind spill out. How do you fake that? Exercise or other menial tasks should help you unlock and let that creativity flow. At least, that's the theory. | Oh this is easy! It's because you're a writer, sweety. Nobody gets the blessing without an irretrievably stupid curse that makes it infuriating to use. If your particular madness is only working between other tasks, make those other tasks a second and third story. Then you're ALWAYS procrastinating on your story...by writing other stories. You've gotta roll with the madness or the madness is going to roll you. | 1 | 5,413 | 2.333333 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgfyfe | htgkbkc | 1,642,685,957 | 1,642,688,017 | 2 | 7 | Well, covid makes you pretty exhausted and BLAH feeling, so of course you didn't do much while you had it. You probably write so much at work because you know you only have a small window of time to write while you're there. If it's working for you, keep doing it. If there's a reason why you HAVE to write at home instead of where you're currently writing, then set up a relatively small window of time at home where you HAVE to write as much as you can when you have the chance... like the 45 minutes before you make dinner, or something like that. Figure out how your brain works best, and then use that knowledge to your own advantage. Your brain gets very creative and productive when you've got limited time. | Eric Hoffer (Philosopher) famously known as the longshoreman philosopher would work menial jobs as a migrant, day laborer, longshoreman because it gave him time to think. Your situation is no different really. You disconnect your mind from what you're doing (hopefully you're not a surgeon or nuclear weapons designer) which allows you to really focus on your thoughts. I write better in the AM and when I'm at work, like you. We just need something to distract us and let the creative mind spill out. How do you fake that? Exercise or other menial tasks should help you unlock and let that creativity flow. At least, that's the theory. | 0 | 2,060 | 3.5 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgkbkc | htgf17x | 1,642,688,017 | 1,642,685,503 | 7 | 1 | Eric Hoffer (Philosopher) famously known as the longshoreman philosopher would work menial jobs as a migrant, day laborer, longshoreman because it gave him time to think. Your situation is no different really. You disconnect your mind from what you're doing (hopefully you're not a surgeon or nuclear weapons designer) which allows you to really focus on your thoughts. I write better in the AM and when I'm at work, like you. We just need something to distract us and let the creative mind spill out. How do you fake that? Exercise or other menial tasks should help you unlock and let that creativity flow. At least, that's the theory. | yeah i got a job where i am full time from home and only working fri-sat-sun to focus on my writing. and i never wrote less in my life. somehow the more i try to set aside time for it the less i feel like doing it | 1 | 2,514 | 7 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgkbkc | htgf3y4 | 1,642,688,017 | 1,642,685,541 | 7 | 1 | Eric Hoffer (Philosopher) famously known as the longshoreman philosopher would work menial jobs as a migrant, day laborer, longshoreman because it gave him time to think. Your situation is no different really. You disconnect your mind from what you're doing (hopefully you're not a surgeon or nuclear weapons designer) which allows you to really focus on your thoughts. I write better in the AM and when I'm at work, like you. We just need something to distract us and let the creative mind spill out. How do you fake that? Exercise or other menial tasks should help you unlock and let that creativity flow. At least, that's the theory. | You have too many distractions at home. That's why I always go to coffee shops or some other neutral space to write. | 1 | 2,476 | 7 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htga47x | htg9lgc | 1,642,682,901 | 1,642,682,604 | 4 | 3 | Do you actually feel sick ? Cuz I got sick not long ago so I was at home and got frustrated not having the energy to write while having so much free time at home. But that's how it is, don't feel bad about it if you are actually sick | Oh this is easy! It's because you're a writer, sweety. Nobody gets the blessing without an irretrievably stupid curse that makes it infuriating to use. If your particular madness is only working between other tasks, make those other tasks a second and third story. Then you're ALWAYS procrastinating on your story...by writing other stories. You've gotta roll with the madness or the madness is going to roll you. | 1 | 297 | 1.333333 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | hth24mu | htgfyfe | 1,642,695,194 | 1,642,685,957 | 3 | 2 | Do you normally struggle to write at home? I didn't have a single coherent thought while sick with Covid. I wouldn't put much stock into this, honestly. | Well, covid makes you pretty exhausted and BLAH feeling, so of course you didn't do much while you had it. You probably write so much at work because you know you only have a small window of time to write while you're there. If it's working for you, keep doing it. If there's a reason why you HAVE to write at home instead of where you're currently writing, then set up a relatively small window of time at home where you HAVE to write as much as you can when you have the chance... like the 45 minutes before you make dinner, or something like that. Figure out how your brain works best, and then use that knowledge to your own advantage. Your brain gets very creative and productive when you've got limited time. | 1 | 9,237 | 1.5 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgf17x | hth24mu | 1,642,685,503 | 1,642,695,194 | 1 | 3 | yeah i got a job where i am full time from home and only working fri-sat-sun to focus on my writing. and i never wrote less in my life. somehow the more i try to set aside time for it the less i feel like doing it | Do you normally struggle to write at home? I didn't have a single coherent thought while sick with Covid. I wouldn't put much stock into this, honestly. | 0 | 9,691 | 3 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | hth24mu | htgf3y4 | 1,642,695,194 | 1,642,685,541 | 3 | 1 | Do you normally struggle to write at home? I didn't have a single coherent thought while sick with Covid. I wouldn't put much stock into this, honestly. | You have too many distractions at home. That's why I always go to coffee shops or some other neutral space to write. | 1 | 9,653 | 3 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgfyfe | htgf17x | 1,642,685,957 | 1,642,685,503 | 2 | 1 | Well, covid makes you pretty exhausted and BLAH feeling, so of course you didn't do much while you had it. You probably write so much at work because you know you only have a small window of time to write while you're there. If it's working for you, keep doing it. If there's a reason why you HAVE to write at home instead of where you're currently writing, then set up a relatively small window of time at home where you HAVE to write as much as you can when you have the chance... like the 45 minutes before you make dinner, or something like that. Figure out how your brain works best, and then use that knowledge to your own advantage. Your brain gets very creative and productive when you've got limited time. | yeah i got a job where i am full time from home and only working fri-sat-sun to focus on my writing. and i never wrote less in my life. somehow the more i try to set aside time for it the less i feel like doing it | 1 | 454 | 2 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htgf3y4 | htgfyfe | 1,642,685,541 | 1,642,685,957 | 1 | 2 | You have too many distractions at home. That's why I always go to coffee shops or some other neutral space to write. | Well, covid makes you pretty exhausted and BLAH feeling, so of course you didn't do much while you had it. You probably write so much at work because you know you only have a small window of time to write while you're there. If it's working for you, keep doing it. If there's a reason why you HAVE to write at home instead of where you're currently writing, then set up a relatively small window of time at home where you HAVE to write as much as you can when you have the chance... like the 45 minutes before you make dinner, or something like that. Figure out how your brain works best, and then use that knowledge to your own advantage. Your brain gets very creative and productive when you've got limited time. | 0 | 416 | 2 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | hti8f1k | htif3we | 1,642,711,120 | 1,642,713,553 | 0 | 1 | Get a therapist | Same!! I do almost all of my writing at work and when I was younger in class. At home, nothing but crickets. I feel your pain! | 0 | 2,433 | 1,000 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | htj6qvl | hti8f1k | 1,642,725,247 | 1,642,711,120 | 1 | 0 | Personally I do things better when I'm procrastinating doing something else but if I try to do it on its own it's harder. | Get a therapist | 1 | 14,127 | 1,000 | ||
s8h5og | writing_train | 0.95 | So what's up with this: I can write thousands of words, but ONLY when I'm literally at work in-between tasks. But I get covid and am out for a week? I WROTE NOTHING. Why? Too much freetime at home? Home is labeled "fun" and work isn't? No motivation? It ain't a discipline issue, that I know of, because I've *forced* myself to fucking write this week and it's all jumbled garbage. Where I usually can make sentences flow with ease and they just pour out, at home, it's like I'm tryna shove the circle into the square hole. What is *up* with this? ...Also, how do I fix it? I'd like to be able to write in other places? Like, I can honestly only write mainly at work. A few hours after I still have my magic and I can write at home or on the walk back from work, but at home for more than a day? Poof. Gone. No writing, no flowing, no magic. | hti8f1k | htl4025 | 1,642,711,120 | 1,642,764,631 | 0 | 1 | Get a therapist | Covid is not a writing retreat. Even pe-covid, when they had to be at home down with the flu or whatever, writers didn't wonder, wow I can't write, who knew?! | 0 | 53,511 | 1,000 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h27tg6t | h27t0al | 1,624,028,587 | 1,624,028,387 | 13 | 5 | Do not go back and edit. Write the story from beginning to end first. | End with a notable. A scene ending with a strategic transition to another place. Usually time. A basic example is walking home with your crush, and him/her kissing you goodnight. | 1 | 200 | 2.6 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h284ja1 | h281f9d | 1,624,033,534 | 1,624,032,143 | 5 | 1 | You can do both. You can make the executive decision to edit now and then move on to continue writing the next chapter next time, or continue your next chapter now and edit your prologue in your next writing session. People on this sub by and large have a one-track mind. So, for the most part, they'll tell you only to do one thing at a time. Write out your words. Only when done, edit your words. Only when done, send to beta readers. Only when done, learn how publishing works and querying works. Only when done, learn the available methods for marketing your book. Only when failing to traditionally publish, learn the proper avenues of self-publishing. Etc etc. But, these are the same people who by and large hate what they write, hate the words they throw down on the page. So, they avert their gaze from it--and recommend to others to do the same. Why blind yourself in order to follow other people who have blinded themselves? Often times, their interest in their works-in-progress fizzle out and they jump haphazardly from project to project, idea to idea. This is because they haven't invested anything serious into their past written words. No serious time or effort, such as what comes with editting. Spilling words out on a page is the easiest part of writing; molding those paragraphs/chapters into something of worth is the more difficult part. That is the part that will feed your confidence, skill as a writer, and voice in a given work. The reality is... you know yourself. Better than any of us. If you can handle doing different tasks on different days, if you can juggle between them, do so. You're in a specific frame of mind, mood, on a specific day/week in a specific year when you first wrote and then finished this prologue. All the events, social/personal interactions, emotional states, stories you were reading, anything going on in around that time--influenced your writing. You can wait until some time later and hope you get back in that same zone/perspective then (*where was I going with this sentence back then?*)... or you can expand on it now while the you you were when you first wrote it still lingers, consciously and subconsciously. | Write the story and then go back and see if you can figure out a way to sprinkle the prologue into the first few chapters and then get rid of the prologue entirely. | 1 | 1,391 | 5 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h281f9d | h293yu6 | 1,624,032,143 | 1,624,049,481 | 1 | 2 | Write the story and then go back and see if you can figure out a way to sprinkle the prologue into the first few chapters and then get rid of the prologue entirely. | You’ll probably come up with a way better prologue once you finish your first draft. I’m in a similar position where I’m 100% certain I’m going to end up rewriting mine since I’m on my first First Draft too, but I won’t until I complete it. With that being said, editing now and adding on to it is perfectly valid if that’s what you want to do. There’s no one right way to do anything. | 0 | 17,338 | 2 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h293yu6 | h28xxzb | 1,624,049,481 | 1,624,046,735 | 2 | 1 | You’ll probably come up with a way better prologue once you finish your first draft. I’m in a similar position where I’m 100% certain I’m going to end up rewriting mine since I’m on my first First Draft too, but I won’t until I complete it. With that being said, editing now and adding on to it is perfectly valid if that’s what you want to do. There’s no one right way to do anything. | Always just keep writing. Your idea's will change. Near the end of the story you will see things that don't make sense from the beginning. You will want to add more in the beginning after you get through the end. Editing now will just slow you down with little to no gain. | 1 | 2,746 | 2 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h281f9d | h2961k4 | 1,624,032,143 | 1,624,050,444 | 1 | 2 | Write the story and then go back and see if you can figure out a way to sprinkle the prologue into the first few chapters and then get rid of the prologue entirely. | Write first. Edit second. It is very easy to get caught up in revising and rewriting and never actually finish anything. And no matter how meticulously planned out your outline is, your actual story will end up taking unexpected twists and turns regardless. So trying to make the early parts perfect is pointless because you'll inevitably have to revisit them anyway. Just write. Beyond that, here's another piece of advice that is very much my opinion and other people here may disagree with. Don't dump a ton of unnecessary lore on the reader, and especially don't do it in the prologue. Genre fiction and especially fantasy writers have this bad habit of missing the trees for the forest. I don't read stories for the world-building. I read them for the characters, their actions, the tension and consequences that evolve throughout the story. That's the meat of a novel. If I'm invested in that stuff *then* I might become interested in the "lore," but a bunch of details about the world aren't inherently interesting without an emotional through line to make them worth caring about. A lot of people don't like prologues and some even skip them entirely, for precisely this reason. Too many authors use them as a lore dump that they think is important but which is ultimately not necessary for the story itself. Once you've written more of the actual story itself, revisit the prologue and ask yourself, "would the rest of the story make sense if this weren't here?" If the answer is yes, cut it entirely, sprinkle the most important details throughout the rest of the story instead. (This doesn't mean no world-building ever. Just not to the detriment of the story itself.) | 0 | 18,301 | 2 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h28xxzb | h2961k4 | 1,624,046,735 | 1,624,050,444 | 1 | 2 | Always just keep writing. Your idea's will change. Near the end of the story you will see things that don't make sense from the beginning. You will want to add more in the beginning after you get through the end. Editing now will just slow you down with little to no gain. | Write first. Edit second. It is very easy to get caught up in revising and rewriting and never actually finish anything. And no matter how meticulously planned out your outline is, your actual story will end up taking unexpected twists and turns regardless. So trying to make the early parts perfect is pointless because you'll inevitably have to revisit them anyway. Just write. Beyond that, here's another piece of advice that is very much my opinion and other people here may disagree with. Don't dump a ton of unnecessary lore on the reader, and especially don't do it in the prologue. Genre fiction and especially fantasy writers have this bad habit of missing the trees for the forest. I don't read stories for the world-building. I read them for the characters, their actions, the tension and consequences that evolve throughout the story. That's the meat of a novel. If I'm invested in that stuff *then* I might become interested in the "lore," but a bunch of details about the world aren't inherently interesting without an emotional through line to make them worth caring about. A lot of people don't like prologues and some even skip them entirely, for precisely this reason. Too many authors use them as a lore dump that they think is important but which is ultimately not necessary for the story itself. Once you've written more of the actual story itself, revisit the prologue and ask yourself, "would the rest of the story make sense if this weren't here?" If the answer is yes, cut it entirely, sprinkle the most important details throughout the rest of the story instead. (This doesn't mean no world-building ever. Just not to the detriment of the story itself.) | 0 | 3,709 | 2 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h29j9w5 | h281f9d | 1,624,057,240 | 1,624,032,143 | 2 | 1 | 1776 words is a bad omen for a user called ‘Brit’. I would recommend adding or deleting at least one word. | Write the story and then go back and see if you can figure out a way to sprinkle the prologue into the first few chapters and then get rid of the prologue entirely. | 1 | 25,097 | 2 | ||
o2qyrz | writing_train | 0.77 | Just finished the prologue of my first novel So I decided to write a fantasy novel that I've been coming up with for about a year now. I started writing the prologue a few days ago and have "finished" it now. So far it's got only 1776 words and I think I can double that (I tend to be very succinct with my writing and not exactly detailed) but I'm not sure if I should add more to it now or continue writing the story and then go back to the start and edit/add more. Would love to hear your advice. | h28xxzb | h29j9w5 | 1,624,046,735 | 1,624,057,240 | 1 | 2 | Always just keep writing. Your idea's will change. Near the end of the story you will see things that don't make sense from the beginning. You will want to add more in the beginning after you get through the end. Editing now will just slow you down with little to no gain. | 1776 words is a bad omen for a user called ‘Brit’. I would recommend adding or deleting at least one word. | 0 | 10,505 | 2 | ||
sy1656 | writing_train | 0.8 | I want to write a novel but I can only write short stories (400-1000 words). I have tried to write a full novel but got 1 chapter in and just got lost. I need help because I do want to write at least a 20-50k word novel eventually. Does anyone have any advice? | hxv79zp | hxv8lo7 | 1,645,470,551 | 1,645,471,080 | 4 | 9 | Create several short stories that can eventually be linked together to be one longer story, that way you’re not focused on the length all at once | I don’t write books, but I write screenplays with my partner. There’s no right way to write, but what helped me was outlining the story arch as a whole, and then mirroring the themes and tone in smaller sections (chapters in this case). Treat each chapter as a short story. If you stuck to your outline, your characters, plot, tone, and writing style will act as the glue that holds it together. To feel right, each segment of your story should resemble whichever basic story structure you subscribe to. Think of it like a fractal; the novel has establishes the setting, builds to a climax, and resolves (or doesn’t resolve to build tension). Events in a chapter should do the same. I used to oppose outlining, thinking it was was a detriment to creativity, however the opposite occurred; I found extreme creative freedom once I no longer had to worry about “getting lost”. Knowing what you’re writing towards still allows you to get lost in the process, but having milestones to reach gives you scope and keeps you on target. Working within limitations is essential for all artists. But whatever you do, DO NOT over-outline. Stick to the broad concepts and beats. Allow the details to emerge as you actively write. Your novel is just a collection of short stories with a goal. You can do this! | 0 | 529 | 2.25 | ||
sy1656 | writing_train | 0.8 | I want to write a novel but I can only write short stories (400-1000 words). I have tried to write a full novel but got 1 chapter in and just got lost. I need help because I do want to write at least a 20-50k word novel eventually. Does anyone have any advice? | hxvbfqo | hxvhovc | 1,645,472,213 | 1,645,474,748 | 3 | 4 | What I do is I think of each chapter kind of like a short story without an end I guess | For most genres, 20-50K is less a novel and more a novella. I would aim for one end of that range or the other in order to make it easier to write toward your goal. Regardless of length, you should study common ways of structuring and outlining novels, e.g. The Hero's Journey, the Snyder Beat Sheet, the Plot Dot, etc. What you'll notice is that the major plot events tend to happen around *the same percent of pages/words* into a story. So lay your 20K or 50K word goal against one of these structures and note roughly where the inciting incident, midpoint, etc. should go in terms of word-count. With your writing background, it might be helpful to write toward these smaller milestones vs writing start to finish. | 0 | 2,535 | 1.333333 | ||
sy1656 | writing_train | 0.8 | I want to write a novel but I can only write short stories (400-1000 words). I have tried to write a full novel but got 1 chapter in and just got lost. I need help because I do want to write at least a 20-50k word novel eventually. Does anyone have any advice? | hxvborn | hxvhovc | 1,645,472,313 | 1,645,474,748 | 2 | 4 | Complicated the plot and then you will have plenty to write | For most genres, 20-50K is less a novel and more a novella. I would aim for one end of that range or the other in order to make it easier to write toward your goal. Regardless of length, you should study common ways of structuring and outlining novels, e.g. The Hero's Journey, the Snyder Beat Sheet, the Plot Dot, etc. What you'll notice is that the major plot events tend to happen around *the same percent of pages/words* into a story. So lay your 20K or 50K word goal against one of these structures and note roughly where the inciting incident, midpoint, etc. should go in terms of word-count. With your writing background, it might be helpful to write toward these smaller milestones vs writing start to finish. | 0 | 2,435 | 2 | ||
sy1656 | writing_train | 0.8 | I want to write a novel but I can only write short stories (400-1000 words). I have tried to write a full novel but got 1 chapter in and just got lost. I need help because I do want to write at least a 20-50k word novel eventually. Does anyone have any advice? | hxvborn | hxwc1og | 1,645,472,313 | 1,645,487,139 | 2 | 3 | Complicated the plot and then you will have plenty to write | Think of each chapter as its own short story. Just make sure to make all the chapters build on each other into a coherent story. To do that, you will need to do some overall plot planning. | 0 | 14,826 | 1.5 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ijaddu4 | ij9xgw6 | 1,659,859,613 | 1,659,848,112 | 6 | -1 | The first time I finished my first draft of my first book (by far the biggest thing I’d ever written) I rewarded myself with a developmental edit from a professional. After that, I took several drafts before anyone read it again. It went through a complete rewrite. Then I’m my MA program I submitted a chapter at a time for my thesis project and workshopped those. By the time THAT draft was done, I got beta readers. All this to say… it helped me with a first draft from a professional who could look beyond typos and rough patches, and it helped me again later when I had a 75% polished draft for beta readers. If you think a particular chapter or excerpt needs help you can have a beta reader check it out, but I would save your resources (your readers) for when you have more of it ready for judgment. Fix what you know you can fix, so the readers aren’t giving you feedback you’re expecting | Get a beta now! They’ll help you uncover plot holes that may be harder to fix the further you get into the story. | 1 | 11,501 | -6 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ija1mxb | ijaddu4 | 1,659,850,827 | 1,659,859,613 | -1 | 6 | Get beta readers | The first time I finished my first draft of my first book (by far the biggest thing I’d ever written) I rewarded myself with a developmental edit from a professional. After that, I took several drafts before anyone read it again. It went through a complete rewrite. Then I’m my MA program I submitted a chapter at a time for my thesis project and workshopped those. By the time THAT draft was done, I got beta readers. All this to say… it helped me with a first draft from a professional who could look beyond typos and rough patches, and it helped me again later when I had a 75% polished draft for beta readers. If you think a particular chapter or excerpt needs help you can have a beta reader check it out, but I would save your resources (your readers) for when you have more of it ready for judgment. Fix what you know you can fix, so the readers aren’t giving you feedback you’re expecting | 0 | 8,786 | -6 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ijan7x0 | ij9xgw6 | 1,659,867,872 | 1,659,848,112 | 4 | -1 | It sounds like you have a short story that might have additional pages between short story and novella range. And that you’re interested in developing it now, but that you don’t have a full-length novella or novel yet.
If this is the case, I’m going to offer alternative advice. You should hold off on the beta readers and finish your novel/novella first. Short stories aren’t just novel stories with fewer page counts; they have different beats and needs and subplot amounts (almost none) to create a complete story in that shorter page count. When you expand a short story into a novel, you’re doing things like adding mirrored subplots and characters and like adjusting the beats to broaden the pacing and protagonist development. All these things will change the tone of your novel that a beta reader won’t be able to see right now.
If your plan no matter what is to expand the short story into a longer form, wait until you have that longer form finalized before beta readers look at it. Beta readers should have the finished product to critique so that they can see the big picture at once. It would be better to work with writing critique groups or alpha readers for feedback on this expansion stage. | Get a beta now! They’ll help you uncover plot holes that may be harder to fix the further you get into the story. | 1 | 19,760 | -4 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ijan7x0 | ija1mxb | 1,659,867,872 | 1,659,850,827 | 4 | -1 | It sounds like you have a short story that might have additional pages between short story and novella range. And that you’re interested in developing it now, but that you don’t have a full-length novella or novel yet.
If this is the case, I’m going to offer alternative advice. You should hold off on the beta readers and finish your novel/novella first. Short stories aren’t just novel stories with fewer page counts; they have different beats and needs and subplot amounts (almost none) to create a complete story in that shorter page count. When you expand a short story into a novel, you’re doing things like adding mirrored subplots and characters and like adjusting the beats to broaden the pacing and protagonist development. All these things will change the tone of your novel that a beta reader won’t be able to see right now.
If your plan no matter what is to expand the short story into a longer form, wait until you have that longer form finalized before beta readers look at it. Beta readers should have the finished product to critique so that they can see the big picture at once. It would be better to work with writing critique groups or alpha readers for feedback on this expansion stage. | Get beta readers | 1 | 17,045 | -4 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ij9xgw6 | ijav2mi | 1,659,848,112 | 1,659,873,726 | -1 | 4 | Get a beta now! They’ll help you uncover plot holes that may be harder to fix the further you get into the story. | Write the novel (or novella) first, do at least one self-edit, and then get beta readers. A short story is not a novel (or novella). Whatever feedback you get on the short story version will not be useful for turning it into a longer story. Even if you ask for feedback on where to expand, a beta reader isn’t always going to have the best advice on how to do so. Better to do it yourself. | 0 | 25,614 | -4 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ija1mxb | ijav2mi | 1,659,850,827 | 1,659,873,726 | -1 | 4 | Get beta readers | Write the novel (or novella) first, do at least one self-edit, and then get beta readers. A short story is not a novel (or novella). Whatever feedback you get on the short story version will not be useful for turning it into a longer story. Even if you ask for feedback on where to expand, a beta reader isn’t always going to have the best advice on how to do so. Better to do it yourself. | 0 | 22,899 | -4 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ij9xgw6 | ijc37y1 | 1,659,848,112 | 1,659,893,969 | -1 | 2 | Get a beta now! They’ll help you uncover plot holes that may be harder to fix the further you get into the story. | Wait. | 0 | 45,857 | -2 | ||
wi75vc | writing_train | 0.84 | I have written a short story that I would like to develop into a full novel or novella. Should I get beta readers now, or wait until it's full-length? More context: I had a story in mind for a long time, and when I took a creative writing class in college, finally got it out on paper. I had to cut a lot out in order to keep within the page limit, but even the professor said she felt like it wanted to be longer and encouraged me to extend it on my own time which I would like to finally do now. So a "complete" story is already written. Should I get beta readers now or wait until I have a full novel/novella length written out? | ijc37y1 | ija1mxb | 1,659,893,969 | 1,659,850,827 | 2 | -1 | Wait. | Get beta readers | 1 | 43,142 | -2 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivuyrbp | ivuf7ab | 1,668,111,410 | 1,668,103,733 | 25 | 5 | I don't agree necessarily. The setup is needed to show the instigating incident, to create mood, and other things. I think a simple adventure novel might start that way. It depends on what you write. Certain genres might work the way you say. There are several ways to start a book, not just one. I have a feeling if you were to grab 100 books and do a survey of how many started with at least one chapter of introduction, or "a bang," you would find most start with the introduction. So I guess it is a "personal preference" rather than a rule. | Think the same like you and I just don't know. Guess there are a lot people who like it, otherwise the books wouldn't sell well. For example Tolkien, I hate it when he puts long poems (which are useless for the story) in the middle of the text, just to tighten atmosphere or bringing the readers into the right mood. But that depends from author to author and from reader to reader. Another advice: Start with the main part of the story, then the ending and the beginning/ prologue the latest. | 1 | 7,677 | 5 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivuyrbp | ivuus19 | 1,668,111,410 | 1,668,109,821 | 25 | 1 | I don't agree necessarily. The setup is needed to show the instigating incident, to create mood, and other things. I think a simple adventure novel might start that way. It depends on what you write. Certain genres might work the way you say. There are several ways to start a book, not just one. I have a feeling if you were to grab 100 books and do a survey of how many started with at least one chapter of introduction, or "a bang," you would find most start with the introduction. So I guess it is a "personal preference" rather than a rule. | For my long story, I pretty much cribbed from Max Payne. Starting with a rooftop fight where mc throws a guy over the side, internal thoughts on how much of a crappy week he's had leading up to this moment and a conversation with a partner that may or may not kill him when he leaves the building. Then flashback to fill in details. | 1 | 1,589 | 25 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivuvjy1 | ivuyrbp | 1,668,110,129 | 1,668,111,410 | 1 | 25 | The first chapter is what is supposed to hook people, so having in media res helps to leave the lesser parts of the build up for when they are invested | I don't agree necessarily. The setup is needed to show the instigating incident, to create mood, and other things. I think a simple adventure novel might start that way. It depends on what you write. Certain genres might work the way you say. There are several ways to start a book, not just one. I have a feeling if you were to grab 100 books and do a survey of how many started with at least one chapter of introduction, or "a bang," you would find most start with the introduction. So I guess it is a "personal preference" rather than a rule. | 0 | 1,281 | 25 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvrf6t | ivuf7ab | 1,668,123,359 | 1,668,103,733 | 6 | 5 | You need to have some setup man. Action alone won’t pull in readers if they don’t know what the hell is happening or why. | Think the same like you and I just don't know. Guess there are a lot people who like it, otherwise the books wouldn't sell well. For example Tolkien, I hate it when he puts long poems (which are useless for the story) in the middle of the text, just to tighten atmosphere or bringing the readers into the right mood. But that depends from author to author and from reader to reader. Another advice: Start with the main part of the story, then the ending and the beginning/ prologue the latest. | 1 | 19,626 | 1.2 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvonth | ivvrf6t | 1,668,122,134 | 1,668,123,359 | 5 | 6 | Nah there is a reason we need to have some set up and introduction of the character: we don’t care about the action until we care about the character dealing with them. Many stories do just get into the action sometimes and they are terrible because your like “what’s happening and why should I care?” The set up is the bit that makes you care | You need to have some setup man. Action alone won’t pull in readers if they don’t know what the hell is happening or why. | 0 | 1,225 | 1.2 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvonth | ivvkecx | 1,668,122,134 | 1,668,120,246 | 5 | 2 | Nah there is a reason we need to have some set up and introduction of the character: we don’t care about the action until we care about the character dealing with them. Many stories do just get into the action sometimes and they are terrible because your like “what’s happening and why should I care?” The set up is the bit that makes you care | I’d say just accept the fact that you’re going to be revising that first chapter a lot, if not throwing it out and rewriting it entirely, multiple times. It’s easier when you have a master level understanding of the rest of your story and what exactly you want to promise to the reader in those first pages, which is unlikely to happen before the first draft is finished. | 1 | 1,888 | 2.5 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivuus19 | ivvonth | 1,668,109,821 | 1,668,122,134 | 1 | 5 | For my long story, I pretty much cribbed from Max Payne. Starting with a rooftop fight where mc throws a guy over the side, internal thoughts on how much of a crappy week he's had leading up to this moment and a conversation with a partner that may or may not kill him when he leaves the building. Then flashback to fill in details. | Nah there is a reason we need to have some set up and introduction of the character: we don’t care about the action until we care about the character dealing with them. Many stories do just get into the action sometimes and they are terrible because your like “what’s happening and why should I care?” The set up is the bit that makes you care | 0 | 12,313 | 5 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvonth | ivvmraq | 1,668,122,134 | 1,668,121,286 | 5 | 1 | Nah there is a reason we need to have some set up and introduction of the character: we don’t care about the action until we care about the character dealing with them. Many stories do just get into the action sometimes and they are terrible because your like “what’s happening and why should I care?” The set up is the bit that makes you care | Define waste. You won't know the main plot of my series until book 5 of 10, but that doesn't mean you won't be intrigued at the characters and their interactions in the meantime | 1 | 848 | 5 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvonth | ivuvjy1 | 1,668,122,134 | 1,668,110,129 | 5 | 1 | Nah there is a reason we need to have some set up and introduction of the character: we don’t care about the action until we care about the character dealing with them. Many stories do just get into the action sometimes and they are terrible because your like “what’s happening and why should I care?” The set up is the bit that makes you care | The first chapter is what is supposed to hook people, so having in media res helps to leave the lesser parts of the build up for when they are invested | 1 | 12,005 | 5 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvonth | ivvjg0f | 1,668,122,134 | 1,668,119,830 | 5 | 1 | Nah there is a reason we need to have some set up and introduction of the character: we don’t care about the action until we care about the character dealing with them. Many stories do just get into the action sometimes and they are terrible because your like “what’s happening and why should I care?” The set up is the bit that makes you care | Depends on the genre; an avid fantasy reader will happily wait until chapter 4-5 for the inciting incident to really hook them as long as they are fed pieces along the way. The same can probably not be said about other genres. | 1 | 2,304 | 5 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvrf6t | ivvkecx | 1,668,123,359 | 1,668,120,246 | 6 | 2 | You need to have some setup man. Action alone won’t pull in readers if they don’t know what the hell is happening or why. | I’d say just accept the fact that you’re going to be revising that first chapter a lot, if not throwing it out and rewriting it entirely, multiple times. It’s easier when you have a master level understanding of the rest of your story and what exactly you want to promise to the reader in those first pages, which is unlikely to happen before the first draft is finished. | 1 | 3,113 | 3 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvrf6t | ivuus19 | 1,668,123,359 | 1,668,109,821 | 6 | 1 | You need to have some setup man. Action alone won’t pull in readers if they don’t know what the hell is happening or why. | For my long story, I pretty much cribbed from Max Payne. Starting with a rooftop fight where mc throws a guy over the side, internal thoughts on how much of a crappy week he's had leading up to this moment and a conversation with a partner that may or may not kill him when he leaves the building. Then flashback to fill in details. | 1 | 13,538 | 6 | ||
yrl0xa | writing_train | 0.89 | Don't waste time at the beginning One of the best pieces of advance I've ever heard is, "start as far into the story as possible." I had to take a break from working on my book for two months which was the longest I've gone without looking at it. Been trying to read some novels to get myself back in the writing mood and my God, I forgot how the plot to so many books don't actually get going until chapter 4-5 or so. Why do writers do this? I understand the need to get the audience acquainted with the characters first, but you can do that \*\*as\*\* the plot is going on. I've sampled a number of free audiobooks and most of them you can skip the first few chapters and not really miss anything. I believe the most important chapter of a stand alone book is the first chapter. No matter how great it gets, if you don't hook them by the first chapter they may not bother with the second. Don't waste time and start off with a bang. | ivvrf6t | ivvmraq | 1,668,123,359 | 1,668,121,286 | 6 | 1 | You need to have some setup man. Action alone won’t pull in readers if they don’t know what the hell is happening or why. | Define waste. You won't know the main plot of my series until book 5 of 10, but that doesn't mean you won't be intrigued at the characters and their interactions in the meantime | 1 | 2,073 | 6 |
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